Artix Linux => Installation / Migration / Configuration => Topic started by: user_abc on 09 August 2023, 21:56:33
Title: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: user_abc on 09 August 2023, 21:56:33
Hi, I just installed Artix, but for some reason I can only load the EFI bootloaders within the menu that pops up when I boot the system with the USB flash drive (the "installation menu"), basically I go to "Detect EFI bootloaders" and select it; but when I boot the PC without the USB I can't start it, since apparently the EFI bootloaders doesn't get detected.
I installed it in a UEFI machine in a GPT-type SSD, I tried to install Artix before with the "standard BIOS" but this Samsung BIOS is simplified to the point of not having this option.
P.S.: I used "grub-install --target=x86_64-efi --efi-directory=/boot/efi --bootloader-id=grub" and "grub-mkconfig -o /boot/grub/grub.cfg" in the end.
Thanks.
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: nous on 09 August 2023, 22:21:15
Which ISO? Please post /etc/os-release.
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: mrbrklyn on 09 August 2023, 23:16:36
Obvoously /boot/efi is on an extended vfat32 partition?
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: user_abc on 10 August 2023, 03:48:54
I wonder if the problem is in my BIOS, I'm using a laptop recently launched by Samsung, and it also came with Windows 11 installed; as I said, I tried to enable csm UEFI but I couldn't find it in the BIOS, very few options there.
Obvoously /boot/efi is on an extended vfat32 partition?
It is, I can normally launch the OS, but only through the USB flash drive menu, by choosing the bootloaders there, the BIOS itself doesn't seem to detect it I think.
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: nous on 10 August 2023, 09:53:57
that information is not very enlightening. You have something fundementally wrong happening here and your not helping to make it clear because you you keep using the term BIOS incorrectly. Start from the beginning and make SURE you have an correct partition which should include a /boot/efi vfat UEFI partition.
It looks like you have a windows boot manager. It is possible that it can't be removed because of secure boot. You should be able to use it to boot the linux kernal anyway.
If you are using GPT, which is highly possible, you need to make sure you leave some empty space on the drive on the end (i think - search for gpt and EFI)
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: user_abc on 10 August 2023, 18:21:44
that information is not very enlightening. You have something fundementally wrong happening here and your not helping to make it clear because you you keep using the term BIOS incorrectly. Start from the beginning and make SURE you have an correct partition which should include a /boot/efi vfat UEFI partition.
It looks like you have a windows boot manager. It is possible that it can't be removed because of secure boot. You should be able to use it to boot the linux kernal anyway.
If you are using GPT, which is highly possible, you need to make sure you leave some empty space on the drive on the end (i think - search for gpt and EFI)
I have redone the installation multiple times, but the problem still persists, and made sure to make the vfat UEFI partition. I think the fact that the USB flash drive can detect the EFI bootloader already tells that the vfat boot partition is set correctely, otherwise it wouldn't even detect it.
In the "Samsung BIOS Configuration" I can turn off the "Secure Boot Control", I did it but still doesn't work.
I'm using GPT, by leaving an empty space on the drive you mean setting a partition appart? I searched about and found this: "On a BIOS/GPT configuration, a BIOS boot partition is required [...] For UEFI systems this extra partition is not required, since no embedding of boot sectors takes place in that case. However, UEFI systems still require an EFI system partition."
I bought my laptop recently and it's a recent Samsung model, I'm suspecting that it's "biased" to the Windows OS and for this reason It is not detecting the bootloader.
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: nous on 10 August 2023, 20:12:29
It actually is, it's the first debugging step. Had @user_abc performed a non-base install, I bet it would have succeeded. @user_abc Post 'fdisk -l /dev/sdX', where X your installation drive.
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: user_abc on 10 August 2023, 21:04:53
It actually is, it's the first debugging step. Had @user_abc performed a non-base install, I bet it would have succeeded. @user_abc Post 'fdisk -l /dev/sdX', where X your installation drive.
Thanks for the reply, here it is (P.S.: My installation drive is named "nvme0n1"):
Device Start End Sectors Size Type /dev/nvme0n1p1 2048 2099199 2097152 1G Linux filesystem /dev/nvme0n1p2 2099200 1000214527 998115328 475.9G Linux filesystem
[EDIT by a mod: code tags]
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: nous on 10 August 2023, 21:58:15
Device Start End Sectors Size Type /dev/nvme0n1p1 2048 2099199 2097152 1G Linux filesystem /dev/nvme0n1p2 2099200 1000214527 998115328 475.9G Linux filesystem
So, there's no VFAT partition for the EFI whatsitsname, so you didn't read the installation instructions (https://wiki.artixlinux.org/Main/Installation) carefully. There's a note about the EFI system partition (https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/EFI_system_partition) you missed. Or do a non-base install with calamares and see how it creates the partition layout.
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: mrbrklyn on 10 August 2023, 23:40:08
that information is not very enlightening. You have something fundementally wrong happening here and your not helping to make it clear because you you keep using the term BIOS incorrectly. Start from the beginning and make SURE you have an correct partition which should include a /boot/efi vfat UEFI partition.
It looks like you have a windows boot manager. It is possible that it can't be removed because of secure boot. You should be able to use it to boot the linux kernal anyway.
If you are using GPT, which is highly possible, you need to make sure you leave some empty space on the drive on the end (i think - search for gpt and EFI)
I have redone the installation multiple times, but the problem still persists, and made sure to make the vfat UEFI partition. I think the fact that the USB flash drive can detect the EFI bootloader already tells that the vfat boot partition is set correctely, otherwise it wouldn't even detect it.
In the "Samsung BIOS Configuration" I can turn off the "Secure Boot Control", I did it but still doesn't work.
I'm using GPT, by leaving an empty space on the drive you mean setting a partition appart? I searched about and found this: "On a BIOS/GPT configuration, a BIOS boot partition is required [...] For UEFI systems this extra partition is not required, since no embedding of boot sectors takes place in that case. However, UEFI systems still require an EFI system partition."
I bought my laptop recently and it's a recent Samsung model, I'm suspecting that it's "biased" to the Windows OS and for this reason It is not detecting the bootloader.
So, there's no VFAT partition for the EFI whatsitsname, so you didn't read the installation instructions (https://wiki.artixlinux.org/Main/Installation) carefully. There's a note about the EFI system partition (https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/EFI_system_partition) you missed. Or do a non-base install with calamares and see how it creates the partition layout.
I just did it and still the same; I have actually already seem it previously and made this step yesterday in another installation attempt, but the output was the same this time.
I also used: mkfs.fat -F 32 /dev/nvme0n1p1 --> mkdir /mnt/boot --> mkdir /mnt/boot/efi --> mount /dev/nvme0n1p1 /mnt/boot/efi
I used "fdisk -l" and the USB device (/dev/sda) shows its disklabel type as "dos" and its subdirectories like this: Device Boot Start End Sectors Size Id Type /dev/sda1 * 64 1613511 1613448 787.8M 0 Empty /dev/sda2 1613512 1621703 8192 4M ef EFI (FAT-12/16/32)
Meanwhile, the installation drive (/dev/nvme0n1) shows its disklabel type as "gpt" and its subdirectories like this: Device Start End Sectors Size Type /dev/nvme0n1p1 2048 2099199 2097152 1G EFI System /dev/nvme0n1p2 2099200 1000214527 998115328 475.9G Linux filesystem
I'll do a non-base install now, as you suggested, to see if it works at least (but I still pretend to go through the base version in the end).
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: syndrome2 on 11 August 2023, 02:35:31
Did you read a similar thread (https://www.reddit.com/r/artixlinux/comments/14ynmin/cant_boot_into_artix_after_base_installation/) on reddit?
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: user_abc on 11 August 2023, 03:46:53
Did you read a similar thread (https://www.reddit.com/r/artixlinux/comments/14ynmin/cant_boot_into_artix_after_base_installation/) on reddit?
I did, it seems like that's the solution, but I'm not sure how to proceed in the process of making these modifications. 1) I don't have any "functional" OS in my PC, I totally removed Windows, so I guess I don't have the "/efi/microsoft/boot/bootmgfw.efi", I don't know if I can simply create this directory with mkdir and use the "mv" command to insert the grubx64.efi there. 2) I tried the other option but to be honest I don't even remember well if I did it the right way, the last 4 days I've been trying to make it and my brain is struggling.
I'll try to make use of your suggestion again and see if I can make it somehow, thanks.
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: ####### on 11 August 2023, 04:32:00
The Arch wiki has some good if often more detailed than strictly required pages regarding the boot process and UEFI, e.g.: https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/EFI_system_partition (https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/EFI_system_partition)
Your problem is you have no FAT formatted EFI partition - ie a drive partition as made by Gparted or whatever. With UEFI boot, the BIOS starts up and looks for this partition. The bootloader stub in there then passes control onto your OS in the main partition, and the initcpio kernel image in /boot. The Artix ISO includes an EFI partion and then can pass control onto itself, or another OS. If you had 2 Linux's installed then one would not even need Grub to be booted by another in theory, although recent Grub os-prober's seem to have difficulty sometimes without a grub.cfg to copy. This FAT efi partion should be mounted on /boot/efi (the Arch wiki page actually suggests /efi but I haven't seen that used before)
Traditional non-efi boot did something similar but the BIOS looked in the MBR which was always present for the first stage then was directed onwards from there. Here you need to make a space for the bootloader yourself before installing it.
If you look carefully at the instructions on the Artix wiki it should help: https://wiki.artixlinux.org/Main/Installation#Partition_your_disk (https://wiki.artixlinux.org/Main/Installation#Partition_your_disk)
BIOS >>> EFI partion (FAT32) >>> Linux partition (EXT / BTRFS / ZFS or whatever)
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: mrbrklyn on 11 August 2023, 05:02:03
I also used: mkfs.fat -F 32 /dev/nvme0n1p1 --> mkdir /mnt/boot --> mkdir /mnt/boot/efi --> mount /dev/nvme0n1p1 /mnt/boot/efi
that will not work. I alreadu SAID that the partition has to point to /boot/efi
Quote
I used "fdisk -l" and the USB device (/dev/sda) shows its disklabel type as "dos" and its subdirectories like this: Device Boot Start End Sectors Size Id Type /dev/sda1 * 64 1613511 1613448 787.8M 0 Empty /dev/sda2 1613512 1621703 8192 4M ef EFI (FAT-12/16/32)
fdsik will not work correctly. cfdisk.
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: tintin on 11 August 2023, 05:03:57
I used "fdisk -l" and the USB device (/dev/sda) shows its disklabel type as "dos" and its subdirectories like this: Device Boot Start End Sectors Size Id Type /dev/sda1 * 64 1613511 1613448 787.8M 0 Empty /dev/sda2 1613512 1621703 8192 4M ef EFI (FAT-12/16/32)
NOTE: On UEFI systems with a GPT-partitioned disk, there must be an EFI system partition (ESP). The suggested size is around 512 MiB. https://wiki.artixlinux.org/Main/Installation#Partition_your_disk
The Arch wiki has some good if often more detailed than strictly required pages regarding the boot process and UEFI, e.g.: https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/EFI_system_partition (https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/EFI_system_partition)
Your problem is you have no FAT formatted EFI partition - ie a drive partition as made by Gparted or whatever. With UEFI boot, the BIOS starts up and looks for this partition.
there is no bios with efi
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: ####### on 11 August 2023, 14:40:29
Yes, sorry, that is an outdated way of looking at it and inaccurate terminology. On modern UEFI systems the code stored in the ROM (BIOS) chip is now also called the UEFI, but you still have to go into the BIOS / setup / UEFI menu using the relevant F? keys and get it to point to the EFI partition you have made on the hard drive or use efibootmgr to do that from the OS, and that aspect of the UEFI resides on the mobo ROM not on the HDD because you can access it without any HDD. Despite assertions to the contrary it must have some BIOS like stage though - how can it access a FAT32 partition on the HDD otherwise? That requires software (although it could be firmware embedded in hardware) to decode even if most of the older BIOS functions are offloaded.
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: gripped on 11 August 2023, 16:49:38
The battle is lost with BIOS / UEFI terminology. It used to bug me but I've almost accepted the fact that people using 'BIOS' to describe 'UEFI' isn't going away.
If you have a UEFI chip on a motherboard really you are "going into" the "Unified Extensible Firmware Interface (UEFI)" not the BIOS.
And from a support point of view, when people are talking about bootloaders grub etc, the difference between the two matters. If someone is taking about, for example, how to enable the cpu's virtualisation in the UEFI or BIOS then not so much.
But with motherboard vendors still listing 'BIOS' updates and 'BIOS' revisions on the support pages of their UEFI boards and most of the big tech youtubers still talking 'BIOS' settings and "Going into the BIOS" on UEFI boards there is no hope to any reduction in the confusion imho except the passage of time whereby the likelihood decreases that those saying 'BIOS' actually have a BIOS chip because those boards are not made any more.
And I'm guilty of using the wrong terminology myself at times.
They do say language evolves. How many people have to use the wrong word before it becomes the right word ?
Edit: Maybe it's come to this because BIOS is simpler to say ? Edit2: If they had gone with Firmware Unified Central Interface Terminal I suspect that might have caught on?
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: mrbrklyn on 12 August 2023, 01:12:05
The battle is lost with BIOS / UEFI terminology. It used to bug me but I've almost accepted the fact that people using 'BIOS' to describe 'UEFI' isn't going away.
If you have a UEFI chip on a motherboard really you are "going into" the "Unified Extensible Firmware Interface (UEFI)" not the BIOS.
I largely agree in causaul conversation but when your in the weeds of tech support, it is not that easy to ignore.
But it matters to understand what the heck they are talking about because the patitioning is different and the compuer can be switched to BIOS.
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: mrbrklyn on 12 August 2023, 01:21:09
http://www.rodsbooks.com/efi-bootloaders/
FWIW
Title: Re: I can only start Artix with my USB flash drive.
Post by: mrbrklyn on 12 August 2023, 01:23:52
Despite assertions to the contrary it must have some BIOS like stage though - how can it access a FAT32 partition on the HDD otherwise? That requires software (although it could be firmware embedded in hardware) to decode even if most of the older BIOS functions are offloaded.
Because it has a fully functional watered down and programable version of JAVA running from the ROM...
That is likely a major reason for the push for secure boot.